It was horrible what happened yesterday with six people shot in Arizona, plus over a dozen wounded, which included U.S. Representative Gabrielle Giffords.
Words can’t express what their friends and family must be going through, and my thoughts are with them.
That said, what follows is the same outcry that happens each time a violent tragedy occurs: the world is getting worse! Quick! We must do something!
I joined in a conversation on Facebook and butted heads a little, and since I explained my point there, already, I’d like to re-post the conversation here. Also, there were other points made that I liked. My main reason is to save it for myself, since FB threads tend to fall off into the ether, lost forever.
Because I’m not a total douche, I’ll keep the people’s names to just initials:
Subject: The shooting of representative Gabrielle Giffords in Arizona was just horrific. What the fuck are things coming to?
LS: This news story just made me sick. Good night, all.
JM: its disgusting especially that it was a 22 year old KID that did this.. someone so young and yet so bitter and jaded already? someone so desperate that he has to kill innocent people? Its really sad and disgusting.. try to think of some of the good things people do tonight instead L..
Jerrod: I don’t think things are “coming to” anything, really. There have been plenty of psychos killing people throughout history. Look at Columbine over a decade ago.
It doesn’t make it any less tragic, of course, and my heart goes out to these people and their families.
I wonder if this could have been avoided, like who was ignoring signs that this guy was batshit crazy before he did this?
HM: I’m sure our parents said the same thing about JFK.
DM: People have lost their damn minds.
SS: Humans have been crazy with killing for nearly 5000 years. Here is a historical fact for everyone. The first recorded war occurred in 2700 BC,and in nearly 5000 years.We have remained consistently good at killing each other.Really sad that killing has been our races lasting legacy.
JM: Ok, so because killing I s ahistorical fact and because columbine happened, then its ok to ignore the obvious facts of how fast this country is declining? So just because this has happened before, we can shrug our shoulders and say “oh well, it happens all the time”? You guys can but I refuse to accept it and deny the obvious rising tension in this country. If you think a major recession, more crime and more suicide rates are something to shrug off then you’re just one of them. We’re not talking about ‘just another senseless murder’ we’re talking about a shadow of what’s to come. I’m not saying its the end of the world, but AZ is in the midst of some serious trouble, which is symbolic of this entire country. Have fun shrugging it off when one of your family members is a target or caught in the crossfire.
LS: What I meant with “what the fuck are things coming to” was that this country is so divided politically, it’s crossed over into lunacy. Clearly this woman was killed because someone disagreed with her politics. Albeit, someone who was psychotic.
WC: It’s sickening.
Jerrod: Sorry you missed the point, J, that nothing is declining. There is no “oh well” going on here. It’s horrible that this happens, it’s just nothing to prove that things are getting worse.
Yes, it’s clear that someone was killed because a… psycho disagreed with their politics. As with the guy who shot Reagan, the assassination of JFK, Lincoln, and all the way back to Julius Caesar.
Every time tragedy strikes, whether it’s at the hands of humans or Mother Nature, it seems people forget world history and cry “End of Teh World!”
And every time someone points this out, someone likes to jump up and accuse them of being under-sensitive. Well, I’m sorry but I can have a clear head about things while still feeling sympathy for these people. I even stated in my first comment that my heart goes out to them and their families, but heaven forbid I have a less narrow perspective on the world! That must negate everything and turn me into some kind of robot!
J, if more people had level heads during bad times, there might be less of it. This guy, after all, was most likely driven by his emotions than his thinking.
JS: People are crazy. Always have been, always will be. Of course, the fact that Palin had the congresswoman’s address marked on a map with a target over it shouldn’t be glossed over either.
JM: So jarred, you honestly think you are the one with the open mind?? Hahaha right. Sorry but all I see is just another person in denial of what’s going on. Good luck to you. And nice way of resorting to name calling. It makes your point moot.
JM: Btw Jarred, I am not dismissing that this guy clearly had some internal emotional turmoil, nor do I blame govt for this. He’s responsible for his own actions. I might be open to your stance of it not being a shadow of what’s to come, IF thi…s were an isolated case but things are changing drastically. The fact that more and more people are killing over politcal issues today than 10 or 15 years ago just goes to show that desparity is getting stronger. What’s wrong with that train of thought anyhow? I’m not saying give up because our country is starting to suck but wake up calls are here. Its time to do something. Time to restore the hope in the americans. That’s all.
Jerrod: How many other political murders have there been in this country in the past 10 or 15 years as opposed to prior?
And what name did I call you, J? Well, I called you “[her name]” My bad.
You’re sounding pretty irrational with your gatherin…g of a revolution. You’re not going to come shoot me because I disagree with you, are you?
DL: Then what is your solution?
JM: Way to be a sarcastic prick and see points other people are making without being condescending in response. Done with this conversation since you can’t even be mature about it. Calling someone narrow minded, someone that so often sees every…side and was seeing all sides of THIS situation is ignorant and yes, I call it ‘calling names’. If you’d like to continue being a prick you can email me. I’m sure L. doesn’t need this on his page. Otherwise, good luck in your suburban ” the world is fine ” bullshit.
Jerrod: Correct me if I’m wrong, Jillian, but calling someone a sarcastic prick is what’s known as name-calling. Using your own logic, your point is moot.
Did I say the world is fine? You used quotes so it must be there somewhere.
D, am I supposed to have a solution for pointing out that humankind has always been littered with violent nutjobs? Sure, I’d love to see it stop but I don’t how claiming it’s somehow worse than it ever has been solves anything.
Okay, but here’s a possible solution, as I’ve tried to make clear: the reaction to tragedy can be just as harmful, if not more so, than the tragedy itself. 911 is a great example. How many of our soldiers have died overseas now as a direct result to this country’s reaction, versus how many people died on that horrible day?
These crazies do what they do because they’re unstable, emotionally charged, and thinking irrationally. To react in a similar way, without logic in the equation, doesn’t help. It just keeps the coals stirred for more people to do crazy things.
Something needs to be done, yes, but going off about “ZOMG, everything is going to hell! Panic! Panic!” isn’t a healthy way to confront it. And sorry if I’m such an asshole for saying so.
DL: That question was addressed to JM, not you. I guess we more or less replied at the same time. I actually agree with everything you’ve said.
Jerrod: Apologies, D
DL: Not a problem! I should have been more specific as to who I was addressing.
Jerrod: It’s a great subject to debate on, though. And I hope LL understands I’m not trying to go after him for asking. It was a simple enough statement that’s stated anytime something terrible happens, by damn near everyone. So LL, please don’t feel you have to defend yourself to me (you never do). I’m simply trying to have an intelligent discussion on how people react to these things.
[there may be more later, but I imagine it's run its course, for the most part]
***UPDATE:
Wow, a few days later, JM comes back crazier than ever:
JM: btw Jerrod.. you were looking for another death based on today’s politics.. here’s one – Dr. George Tiller, the Kansas doctor who provided abortion services and who was assassinated on May 31, 2009…. ONE
Jerrod: It only took this long to count it! Keep ‘em coming, then compare them to all the murders prior to 10-15 years ago and look for the “decline.”
JM: umm no i didn’t make it a priority, and I’m not LOOKING for them .. and btw, a decline happens over DECADES when did I say it was happening over night? nice try though
Jerrod: When you said this: “The fact that more and more people are killing over politcal issues today than 10 or 15 years ago just goes to show that desparity is getting stronger.”
And I had no idea “10-15 years ago” = “overnight.” Where are you reading that I insinuated this? Are you missing some meds?
JM: ” Are you missing some meds? ”
That’s mature… and real nice.
Jerrod: A logical question considering your behavior and obsession over a days-old thread. And certainly more mature than calling someone a “sarcastic prick.”
JM: you are a sarcastic prick.. you have no idea if i’m on meds or not… you call it obsession.. yet you wanted a full blown list of people killed over political rampage… ummm really? i happen to stumble apon one person, i post it and I’m obsessing? anyway… go ahead, get the last word in
Jerrod: Um, you came on here starting a list. You even numbered it ONE, LOL!
Tosh.O is on and it’s way more interesting than arguing with you, puss [she'd changed her profile pic to a cat]. Take your pills and have a good night.
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